TRACK-LINK / Forums / Research / WW2 / Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS

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Research / WW2

The WW2 forum is intended for asking and discussing reference or historical related issues pertaining to WW2 (1939-1945) subjects.

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Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS [IMG×3] - Roy Chow - May 7, 2015 (05:53:54)

Flat View

. . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS [IMG×1] - Kimmo Happonen - May 7, 2015 - 08:14

. . . . . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS - Roy Chow - May 7, 2015 - 08:55

. . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS - Andrew Dyson - May 7, 2015 - 09:31

. . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS - Terence Teo - May 7, 2015 - 19:50

. . . . . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS - Roy Chow - May 8, 2015 - 05:34

. . . . . . . . . Re: Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS - Paul Owen - May 8, 2015 - 10:43

Subject:	Are these the same tank? Beutepanzer Sherman M4A3 76 VVS
Date:	May 7, 2015 (05:53:54)
From:	Roy Chow

Can you lend me your eyes for a few moments?

[IMAGE 1]

I'm trying to reconcile something about these pictures. I'm trying to figure out whether the third picture of the captured M4A3 76 Sherman is the same as the other two. The 1st 2 pictures show the Sherman shortly after it was KOd by a US M36 (battle of Aschaffenberg, April '45 -- a decal option for both a 1/72 and 1/35 DML kit). The other one shows a rear 3/4 shot from the left side. Parts have been stripped away, likely this is a postwar dump/depot.

It's unclear to me if they are of the same tank -- the question I can't answer is the presence of the white star on the depot Sherman.

Similarities between the first 2 pics and the third picture:

1) the large cross on the left side appears the same -- size, shape & location.

2) the style of sand shields beneath the sponson is the same (and not widely practiced). At minimum, the two tanks likely were from the same unit.

3) both are M4A3 76W VVS tanks, with the later oval hatch (on the depot Sherman, you can see the open hatch & central MG post -- for the two KO pictures, it's clear because you see the raised central MG post (a feature only on the turrets with oval hatches))

Differences:

1) The big star on the left side turret! On the other two pics, there appears to be marking there. Certainly the German operators wouldn't have left a white star uncovered. Perhaps they painted it over and THEN added a white cross? Or just slapped some dark distemper over it that eventually wore off? That would explain why both a turret and the white cross on the hull exist on the left side.

2) the depot Sherman has a missing muzzle break -- but given its turret type, a break must have been issued from the factory. This has likely been scavanged off of this vehicle

3) the cross on the left face of the mantlet isn't visible on the depot Sherman. Washed away/worn off? But why hasn't the side hull cross washed away? Maybe just the angle of the photo?

I'm leaning towards thinking that all the pics show the same vehicle but I think I'm biased to WANTING the depot Sherman to match the other two pics. What do you think of my rationale and possible explanations? Of course, I'm doing this for a modeling project....

Any thoughts? Thanks in advance.